Network Sting: MSW Media Media.
Martin Sheen: Hello and welcome to the second season of the Martin Sheen Podcast with yours truly, Martin Sheen, of course. And I’m delighted to be back hosting this podcast pilgrimage where the destination is still the journey itself. Along the way, I plan to share stories and personal memories of some of the many people, places and events that have helped to shape my lifelong happy and continuing struggle as an artist and a man to unite the will of the spirit with the work of the flesh.
I also hope to explore poetry as a powerful form of expression and communication by proxy, as it were, and how poetry is such a vital and necessary component of our spirituality and our public discourse. And from time to time, I’ll invite friends, fellow actors, poets, scholars and family members to join our pilgrimage and discuss what inspires their artistic journey.
And so, friends, let us begin.
“De Kooning, Jackie and JFK in the fall of 1982”
In the fall of 1982, I was offered the title role of President Kennedy in a TV miniseries entitled “Kennedy” set to air on NBC in November 1983.
I turned down the initial offer and the second one as well because I simply did not believe I could portray him honestly or convincingly. Frankly, I didn’t believe any other actor could do so. But when a third offer came and before I could respond, my wife, Janet suggested I reconsider my stance, “Because,” she said, “you truly loved President Kennedy and if by your were playing him you prevent another actor from playing him who perhaps did not love him, that alone is a worthy motivation to reconsider.” She was right, of course, and after some reflection that was the measure I used to accept that very challenging role of JFK and it was not the only valuable contribution Janet would bring to the “Kennedy” project.
And so, along with the beautiful and talented Blair Brown as Jackie, John Shea as Bobby, Joe Lowery as Dave Powers, with EG Marshall and Geraldine Fitzgerald as Joseph senior and Rose Kennedy, work began on the “Kennedy” mini-series in the spring of 1983 in New York City at a newly built studio on the Upper West Side where all the Oval office scenes would be filmed.
Of note: I asked Floyd Patterson, the former heavyweight boxing champ, to play a brief scene with me recreating his visit with President Kennedy at the White House in 1961, which he graciously agreed to do and on another special occasion, one of my lifelong favorite actors and now friend, James Cagney paid a memorable visit to the set and caused quite a sensation for the cast and crew! I remain grateful to both of those men.
When the Oval Office scenes were completed in New York I returned home to LA for a brief rest and one day while visiting my friend Matt Clark I was browsing through a very large coffee table size book called “Women Artists in America” when suddenly a magnificent color portrait of President Kennedy leapt off the page!
The artist’s name was Elaine de Kooning, wife of the renowned abstract painter Wilhelm de Kooning and the accompanying article revealed that first lady Jacqueline Kennedy had chosen her to paint the official White House portrait of her husband.
Intrigued by this extraordinary story I was determined to contact Mrs. de Kooning for more details but in those days before cell phones and computers you could only make long distance call through ‘long distance’ operators giving them the name and location, in this case New York City and if the person you were trying to reach had a listed phone number you had a good chance of reaching them. The operator found the number in NY and asked if this was a ‘collect call?’ “No,” I said, “please charge it to this number.” (I can’t remember if I paid Matt Clark back but nonetheless) the call went through and to my astonishment Elaine de Kooning herself answered the phone!
After I explained the purpose of my call she very gladly shared the story of how the portrait came about: indeed, the first lady had contacted her to do the portrait in 1963 and invited her to come down to Miami FL in a few weeks, where the president was scheduled to host a large gathering of professionals to discuss the proposed federal government Medicare program.
Jacqueline explained that it was not likely the president would agree to sit for his portrait but since he was chairing this large meeting he would have to remain in one place long enough for an artist to get a good start on his portrait and she asked Elaine to be that artist. Of course, she was thrilled and accepted Jackie’s offer without hesitation. And so…
So several weeks later she joined the first lady wandering among the many tables and chairs in a large ballroom of a hotel in Miami surveying every possible angle for the best unobstructed view of where the president would sit but she was clearly not satisfied.
Then, to Jackie’s surprise, she asked for a ladder which the Secret Service acquired and approved and just before the meeting began she climbed up with her materials and waited.
When the president arrived he looked up, smiled broadly and said, “You’re Jackie’s friend.” “I am,” she responded. “Well,” he said, “thanks for coming and be careful up there” and he started the meeting.
From her advantaged POV, Elaine filled her entire sketch pad with multiple images of the president and when the meeting ended she descended from her perch to find him waiting to greet her and view the sketches.
He was warm and friendly, she said and to her great relief he was impressed with her work. As he left he shook her hand, thanked her and said, “Congratulations. Jackie made a great choice.” But he would never see the finished product.
Less than a week later the president was assassinated in Dallas and Elaine was so deeply saddened and distressed she was unable to look at her sketches of him for many years.
When she was finally able to complete the portrait she presented it to Jackie who was pleased and grateful but since it was too late to present it to the White House it remained with Jacqueline until her death. The portrait is currently on permanent display at the National Portrait Gallery in Washington DC where it is a highly revered main attraction.
It was impossible to weave this remarkable and largely unknown story into the “Kennedy” scenario, of course, but I found a way to encapsulate it by rewriting and enlarging a key scene to include a female artist that sketches me as Kennedy throughout the entire scene and who refer to as Mrs. De Kooning. Then I persuaded a very talented female artist, my wife, Janet, to play her and the scene worked out perfectly.
We filmed it in Miami FL, and it is included in the final cut of the “Kennedy” mini-series.
Unfortunately, I never met Elaine de Kooning in person, and we never spoke again but I often wonder if she ever saw the “Kennedy” series and if so, what she thought.
Elaine de Kooning was born in Brooklyn, NY on March 12th 1918. She died in New York City on February 1st 1989, the same year her husband, Willem died. And the same year Jaqueline Kennedy died as well. Mrs. de Kooning was 70 years old.
We’ll be right back after this.
And we’re back.
Consider this quote attributed to Senator Robert F. Kennedy.
“One heart with courage is a majority.”
In 1986 I was asked to contribute some personal remarks for a soon to be published book called, “Village Life, The Camphill Communities.” Such communities were created for people with developmental disabilities and special needs. The Camphill movement began in Europe in the 1930’s and the very first such village in the U.S. was created in Pennsylvania in 1961. I visited an old friend and his family there and came away with this poem, “Who Are These People?” which was published in that book.
“Who Are These People?”
They are the hostages we surrendered long
ago to ransom a future;
They are a clear reflection and a continuous
confirmation of the very best part of ourselves;
They are that divine dividend, the long promised
blessing reserved for those among us who have
never seen but have always believed;
They are a promise kept, a hope fulfilled,
a dream realized;
They are a manifestation of the profound love that
governs the universe, a love perpetually nourished
by the realization of itself, and a love surrendered
over and over again in joy and gratitude at the
command of the omnipotent spirit,
They are you and me!
The following is a selection from the book “Blessed Among Us” by Robert Ellsberg. It is filled with daily reflections that explore the lives of saints as well as ordinary men and women with stories of extraordinary courage and spiritual awakening.
Marc Chagall was born to a Hasidic Jewish family in a town in Belarus, part of the Russian empire. Determined to become an artist, he moved to Paris, where his distinctive style drew on various modernism influences. His work was marked by recurring dreamlike images of his homeland – rural villages filled with floating cows, fiddlers, roosters, and weddings. After travels in Palestine, biblical images also entered into his work. In 1938, following the Kristallnacht pogrom in Germany, Chagall painted his “White Crucifixion,” depicting Jesus on the cross clothed in a Jewish prayer shawl as a loincloth, and surrounded by scenes of Jewish persecution. This painting, which Pope Francis has named as a personal favorite, not only emphasizes the Jewishness of Jesus but relates the crucifixion to contemporary passion of the Jews and the ongoing suffering of humanity. Christ, for Chagall, symbolized “the true type of the Jewish martyr.” And as the Holocaust unfolded, the number of martyrs swelled beyond imagination.
Chagall managed to escape with his wife to New York in 1941.
She died there two years later. After the war he returned to France,
where he became one of the most celebrated and beloved artists of his time. The visual symbols of his lost village in Belarus – of suffering, love, work, and hope – became the common treasury of humanity. He died on March 28 1985. His Quote: “For me Christ is a great poet, the master whose poetry is already forgotten by the modern world.”
Robert Ellsberg is an American publisher specializing in religious and spiritual exploration. He is editor in chief and publisher of Orbis Books. He lives and works in upstate New York with his wife.
Consider this quote from Mother Teresa.
“I know God will not give me anything I cannot handle. I just wish he didn’t trust me so much.”
Hear now
“My Father at 85”
By Robert Bly.
His large ears
Hear everything
A hermit wakes
And sleeps in a hut
Underneath
He gaunt cheeks,
His eyes blue, alert,
Disappointed,
And suspicious,
Complain I
Do not bring him
The same sort of
Jokes the nurses
Do. He is a bird
Waiting to be fed,-
Mostly beak- an eagle
Or a vulture, or
The Pharaoh’s servant
Just before death.
My arm on the bedrail
Rests there, relaxed,
With new love. All
I know of the Troubadours
I bring to his bed.
I do not want
Or need to be shamed
By him any longer.
The general of shame
Has discharged
Him, and left him
In this small provincial
Egyptian town.
If I do not wish
To shame him, then
Why not love him?
His long hands,
Large, veined,
Capable, can still
Retain hold of what
He wanted. But
Is that what he
Desired? Some
Powerful engine
Of desire goes on
Turning inside his body.
He never phrased
What he desired,
And I am
His son.
Robert Bly was an American poet, essayist and activist, born on Dec. 23, 1926 in Parle County, Minnesota. His best-known prose book is “Iron John: A Book About Men” published in1990, which spent 62 weeks on the New York Times Best Seller list, and is a key text of the Mythopoetic Men’s Movement.
Robert Bly died Nov. 21, 2021 in Minneapolis. Mr. Bly was 94 years old.
We’ll be right back after this.
Welcome back. Thanks for staying with us. Let’s continue.
“The Sound Of The Sea” by Henry Wadsworth Longfellow
The sea awoke at midnight from its sleep,
And round the pebbly beaches far and wide
I heard the first wave of the rising tide
Rush onward with uninterrupted sweep;
A voice out of the silence of the deep,
A sound mysteriously multiplied
As of a cataract from the mountain’s side,
Or roar of winds upon a wooded steep.
So comes to us at times, from the unknown
And inaccessible solitudes of being,
The rushing of the sea-tides of the soul;
And inspirations, that we deem our own,
Are some divine foreshadowing and foreseeing
Of things beyond our reason or control.
Henry Wadsworth Longfellow was an American. He is known for his style of lyric poetry, presenting stories of mythology and legend, such as the Song of Hiawatha and the Village Blacksmith. He was born February 27, 1807, in Portland, Maine, and died on March 24, 1882, in Cambridge, Massachusetts.
Henry Wadsworth Longfellow was 75 years old.
Some by Daniel Berrigan
Some stood up once and sat down.
Someone walked a mile and walked away.
Some stood up twice and sat down
I’ve had it, they said.
Some walked two miles and walked away
It’s too much, they cried.
Some stood and stood and stood.
they were taken for fools
they were taken for being taken in.
Some walked and walked and walked.
They walked the earth
they walked the waters
they walked the air.
Why do you stand?
They were asked, and
why do you walk?
Because of the children, they say, and
because of the heart, and
because of the bread
Because
the cause
is in the heart’s beat
and the children born
and the risen bread
Father Daniel Berrigan was an American Jesuit, as well as an author, teacher, peace activist and poet. He was also a dear friend and mentor. He was born in Virginia, Minnesota, on May 9, 1921. He was raised in Syracuse, New York, and he was ordained in 1951. He died April 30, 2016, in New York City. Dan Berrigan was 96 years old.
I invite you to delve further into the works of the poets I shared with you. You and I hope you seek out writers and poets whose work speaks to your hearts and minds with the power to inspire your life. If you’ve enjoyed what you’ve heard here, please subscribe to my podcast, the Martin Sheen Podcast, with your host, yours truly, Martin Sheen of course, wherever you find your podcasts. Yeah, I have to say that.
You can find a complete list of the poets and titles of their poems that I’ve chosen at our website, themartensheenpodcast.com
I want to thank the people who make this podcast possible, our producer and research assistant, Renee Estevez, who assures me that the Internet is a real thing and a safe place, if not used off label. And our sound engineer and editor, Bruce Greenspan, the man behind these rich and seamless recordings. And to his dog, Gracy, our studio mascot, who snores in perfect pentameter.
And so, friends, we part with the prayer from Tagore.
Where the heart is without fear and the head is held high;
Where knowledge is free;
Where the world has not been broken up into fragments by narrow domestic walls;
Where words come out from the depth of truth;
Where tireless striving stretches its arms towards perfection;
Where the clear stream of reason has not lost its way into the dreary desert sand of dead habit;
Where the mind is led forward by thee into ever-widening thought and action—
Into that heaven of freedom (my Father) let our country awake. Amen
The Martin Sheen Podcast all rights reserved. No part of this podcast may be reproduced, distributed or transmitted in any form without prior written consent of the author and TE Productions.
The Story “de Kooning, Jackie and JFK by Ramon Gerard Estevez, AKA Martin Sheen is included here by granted copyright permission.
Blessed Among Us Mark Chagall by Robert Ellsberg is included here by granted copyright permission and we thank the author for this opportunity to share his work.
My father at 85 by Robert Bly was included here in this podcast by granted copyright permission by his daughter Mary Blythe, who we thank for this opportunity to share his poetry.
The poem Some by Daniel Berrigan is included in this podcast with granted permission and remains the property of the Daniel Berrigan Literary Trust, who we thank for this opportunity to share his writings.
